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	<title>Comments on: Comet. Not as painful as you think!</title>
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	<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/comet-not-as-painful-as-you-think</link>
	<description>Cleaning up the web with Ajax</description>
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		<title>By: jmarranz</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/comet-not-as-painful-as-you-think/comment-page-1#comment-259836</link>
		<dc:creator>jmarranz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Dec 2007 18:28:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3090#comment-259836</guid>
		<description>Ok, Ok Alex don&#039;t bother, Bayeux standardization is fine if you follow the client route and you don&#039;t want to bind your client centric COMET technology to any specific server technology (not a Bayeux based). I&#039;m on the server side and see the world &quot;server centric&quot; :)
Regards</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok, Ok Alex don&#8217;t bother, Bayeux standardization is fine if you follow the client route and you don&#8217;t want to bind your client centric COMET technology to any specific server technology (not a Bayeux based). I&#8217;m on the server side and see the world &#8220;server centric&#8221; :)<br />
Regards</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Russell</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/comet-not-as-painful-as-you-think/comment-page-1#comment-259831</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Russell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 19:52:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3090#comment-259831</guid>
		<description>jmarranz:

perhaps i can frame your objection to Bayeux as a protocol a bit differently: by needing a compliant protocol server, Bayeux encourages interop, a proliferation of clients and servers, and allows anyone to layer behaviors like what you&#039;re talking about (sending code to be executed) on top of an orthogonal protocol stack. Joe Walker and Greg Wilkins have alpha-level Bayeux support in DWR to achieve exactly this: let each level of the stack do what it&#039;s best at and plug them together.

Instead of being one-off, tied to a particular implementation, and requiring you to build the app from the bottom up w/ Comet features in mind, Bayeux lets you put your Comet server in your infrastructure *after* the app it built/deployed....which basically means that railing against lower-level protocols like Bayeux just doesn&#039;t even make sense. ItsNat does something one level up the stack...great! That doesn&#039;t make Bayeux less valuable nor does it imply that they&#039;re mutually exclusive (except for implementation decisions by the ItsNat team).

Regards</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>jmarranz:</p>
<p>perhaps i can frame your objection to Bayeux as a protocol a bit differently: by needing a compliant protocol server, Bayeux encourages interop, a proliferation of clients and servers, and allows anyone to layer behaviors like what you&#8217;re talking about (sending code to be executed) on top of an orthogonal protocol stack. Joe Walker and Greg Wilkins have alpha-level Bayeux support in DWR to achieve exactly this: let each level of the stack do what it&#8217;s best at and plug them together.</p>
<p>Instead of being one-off, tied to a particular implementation, and requiring you to build the app from the bottom up w/ Comet features in mind, Bayeux lets you put your Comet server in your infrastructure *after* the app it built/deployed&#8230;.which basically means that railing against lower-level protocols like Bayeux just doesn&#8217;t even make sense. ItsNat does something one level up the stack&#8230;great! That doesn&#8217;t make Bayeux less valuable nor does it imply that they&#8217;re mutually exclusive (except for implementation decisions by the ItsNat team).</p>
<p>Regards</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: jmarranz</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/comet-not-as-painful-as-you-think/comment-page-1#comment-259826</link>
		<dc:creator>jmarranz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 10:52:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3090#comment-259826</guid>
		<description>The problem of Bayeux protocol is it requires a Bayeux server, the spirit of COMET is server push, the client receives asynchronously some data (or JavaScript) from server. A &quot;simple&quot; approach is using AJAX under the hood to transport XML or JavaScript when the server generates this data, the server can generate the JavaScript code to generate a new AJAX request to continue listening too. 

 In &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.itsnat.org&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;ItsNat&lt;/a&gt; the COMET approach is amazingly simple, only a special Java method is called in the server, CometNotifier.notifiyClient(), and the server will send to the client any pending user defined JavaScript code to the client. This JavaScript code is executed &quot;as is&quot; in the client.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem of Bayeux protocol is it requires a Bayeux server, the spirit of COMET is server push, the client receives asynchronously some data (or JavaScript) from server. A &#8220;simple&#8221; approach is using AJAX under the hood to transport XML or JavaScript when the server generates this data, the server can generate the JavaScript code to generate a new AJAX request to continue listening too. </p>
<p> In <a href="http://www.itsnat.org" rel="nofollow">ItsNat</a> the COMET approach is amazingly simple, only a special Java method is called in the server, CometNotifier.notifiyClient(), and the server will send to the client any pending user defined JavaScript code to the client. This JavaScript code is executed &#8220;as is&#8221; in the client.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Alex Russell</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/comet-not-as-painful-as-you-think/comment-page-1#comment-259819</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Russell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 03:18:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3090#comment-259819</guid>
		<description>The dojox.cometd APIs used hare are *all* of the APIs you&#039;ll see as a developer. They (in order of appearance):

* open up a bi-directional tunnel with a Bayeux server. Once a connection is opened you can publish JSON messages to a named topic and subscribe to hear about messages that you (or other senders) publish to those topics you&#039;re subscribed to
* subscribe a handler to a particular topic
* publish a JSON message to the topic. The serialization of the message into JSON and the wire-level details are all handled for you by the client library.

You send and receive pure JS objects, and it&#039;s all JSON on the wire.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The dojox.cometd APIs used hare are *all* of the APIs you&#8217;ll see as a developer. They (in order of appearance):</p>
<p>* open up a bi-directional tunnel with a Bayeux server. Once a connection is opened you can publish JSON messages to a named topic and subscribe to hear about messages that you (or other senders) publish to those topics you&#8217;re subscribed to<br />
* subscribe a handler to a particular topic<br />
* publish a JSON message to the topic. The serialization of the message into JSON and the wire-level details are all handled for you by the client library.</p>
<p>You send and receive pure JS objects, and it&#8217;s all JSON on the wire.</p>
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		<title>By: Chad Wagner</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/comet-not-as-painful-as-you-think/comment-page-1#comment-259801</link>
		<dc:creator>Chad Wagner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Dec 2007 17:07:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3090#comment-259801</guid>
		<description>Me too, code is not readable for me since I am unfamiliar with those functions, but I will agree that it is short and concise :) But hey, I&#039;ll bet all of the documentation is at the actual blog that is linked to, so my laziness is the culprit!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Me too, code is not readable for me since I am unfamiliar with those functions, but I will agree that it is short and concise :) But hey, I&#8217;ll bet all of the documentation is at the actual blog that is linked to, so my laziness is the culprit!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: getter</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/comet-not-as-painful-as-you-think/comment-page-1#comment-259794</link>
		<dc:creator>getter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Dec 2007 14:55:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3090#comment-259794</guid>
		<description>The example he uses in Jetty is rather difficult to understand due to the lack of proper documentation for cometd and dojox.cometd. I would have to disagree with Simon :-(</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The example he uses in Jetty is rather difficult to understand due to the lack of proper documentation for cometd and dojox.cometd. I would have to disagree with Simon :-(</p>
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