Comments on: Introducing LaCo (or AJAX for the non-programmer) http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer Cleaning up the web with Ajax Thu, 17 May 2012 07:43:39 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Zach http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-86871 Zach Fri, 08 Sep 2006 17:20:05 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-86871 The whole Safari conversation is interesting. Unfortunately I agree with the Safari supporters. For purpose built sites is might be acceptable to support a reasonable and limited number of browsers, but Safari is growing and certainly enough of a contingent that the complaints you clients get (in response to the small but loud group of Mac/Safari users viewing their site) will be enough to turn a lot of people off of a project. Now as for LKM's comment. It seems a little strongly worded. LKM, if what you said *were* true I imagine Apple developers/Mac users would have jumped on the bandwagon ages ago. Lead the way, so to speak. This actually surprizes me, so I'm not trying to denigrate you or Mac users as a whole. But for whatever reason, most of the open toolkits I've come across (Dojo, Rico/Prototype) seems to have issues with Safari, which is one of the only truly compliant browsers out there? Anyway, thats were I'm at. I love the idea of toolkits. LaCo sounds very interesting, especially for the javascript inept (I'm looking at myself) but I've already gone down the road with Dojo developing a great looking snappy website only to find out the client needed Safari support. I wanted to do the kicking and screaming thing, but I saw it as a valid requirment. On my own site Safari is about 8% of my traffic. Thats enough I'd get a pretty big earful if I suddenly decided to spruce it up and broke it for that 8%. :) The whole Safari conversation is interesting. Unfortunately I agree with the Safari supporters. For purpose built sites is might be acceptable to support a reasonable and limited number of browsers, but Safari is growing and certainly enough of a contingent that the complaints you clients get (in response to the small but loud group of Mac/Safari users viewing their site) will be enough to turn a lot of people off of a project.

Now as for LKM’s comment. It seems a little strongly worded. LKM, if what you said *were* true I imagine Apple developers/Mac users would have jumped on the bandwagon ages ago. Lead the way, so to speak.

This actually surprizes me, so I’m not trying to denigrate you or Mac users as a whole. But for whatever reason, most of the open toolkits I’ve come across (Dojo, Rico/Prototype) seems to have issues with Safari, which is one of the only truly compliant browsers out there?

Anyway, thats were I’m at. I love the idea of toolkits. LaCo sounds very interesting, especially for the javascript inept (I’m looking at myself) but I’ve already gone down the road with Dojo developing a great looking snappy website only to find out the client needed Safari support. I wanted to do the kicking and screaming thing, but I saw it as a valid requirment. On my own site Safari is about 8% of my traffic. Thats enough I’d get a pretty big earful if I suddenly decided to spruce it up and broke it for that 8%. :)

]]> By: LKM http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-72001 LKM Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:13:15 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-72001 If you're not supporting Safari, you're not supporting the very people who are most likely to check out cutting-edge new stuff and recommend it to their peers. Not testing in Safari is just plain stupid. If you’re not supporting Safari, you’re not supporting the very people who are most likely to check out cutting-edge new stuff and recommend it to their peers. Not testing in Safari is just plain stupid.

]]> By: Kevin Cannon http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-68315 Kevin Cannon Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:01:12 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-68315 This looks quite interesting. The non-validation would be a deal breaker for me, but as a designer I like the concept. I would like to be able to use Ajax techniques to create pages that do not refresh, but are still accessible, SEO friendly and valid, so I think this shows that things like that can be achievable. I look forward to seeing more scripts like that in the future that I can hopefully use. This looks quite interesting. The non-validation would be a deal breaker for me, but as a designer I like the concept. I would like to be able to use Ajax techniques to create pages that do not refresh, but are still accessible, SEO friendly and valid, so I think this shows that things like that can be achievable.

I look forward to seeing more scripts like that in the future that I can hopefully use.

]]> By: Ryan Lowe http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-68041 Ryan Lowe Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:04:03 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-68041 While "Weak. Doesn’t work in Safari." may be a little harsh of a comment, I do agree with the point here. This is a nice little piece of code, but it doesn't work in Safari. While Safari may not hold very much of the share as far as web browsers go, I don't see how anyone can say that it doesn't matter if you are turning away potential customers. Any web shop, like the one I work for <a href="http://www.spinweb.net" rel="nofollow">SpinWeb</a> can not possibly be taken seriously if they were to ignore any of their clients' customers. Especially when it is not that hard to code for Safari in the first place! While “Weak. Doesn’t work in Safari.” may be a little harsh of a comment, I do agree with the point here. This is a nice little piece of code, but it doesn’t work in Safari. While Safari may not hold very much of the share as far as web browsers go, I don’t see how anyone can say that it doesn’t matter if you are turning away potential customers. Any web shop, like the one I work for SpinWeb can not possibly be taken seriously if they were to ignore any of their clients’ customers. Especially when it is not that hard to code for Safari in the first place!

]]> By: landseer http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-67657 landseer Tue, 15 Aug 2006 12:12:02 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-67657 Don't worry Jon, you are 100% right. A simple "weak, does not work" is not a bugreport that you or anyone else can work with. Don’t worry Jon, you are 100% right. A simple “weak, does not work” is not a bugreport that you or anyone else can work with.

]]> By: Ilia Mogilevsky http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-67518 Ilia Mogilevsky Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:57:44 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-67518 Hey all, It seems to me that this is not Ajax but merely javascript with some css. I could be wrong but doesnt Ajax implies XML/JSON, also with come server side scripting...?!? This is usefull but again as Tahir noted is useless in large web applications.. Anyway my two cents... Hey all,

It seems to me that this is not Ajax but merely javascript with some css. I could be wrong but doesnt Ajax implies XML/JSON, also with come server side scripting…?!?

This is usefull but again as Tahir noted is useless in large web applications..

Anyway my two cents…

]]> By: henrah http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-67500 henrah Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:41:16 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-67500 Link is broken, dawg. Link is broken, dawg.

]]> By: Jon http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66731 Jon Mon, 14 Aug 2006 20:40:33 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66731 Dan/Bill, I suppose my feedback stems from oddities I get when I feel like I'm testing code in FF, IE (5+) and Opera figuring I've hit the majority of browsers only to have a "This doesn't look right in Safari" comment. Normally, the differences between the browsers are pretty small when you stick to standards-based code - but it's hard for me (and the company I work for) to justify additional work hours to support a browser that has a small user base if there are problems. There may be problems with this particular library, but I was reacting to the "Weak. Doesn't work in Safari" comment rather than really taking a look at the code being presented. That being said, I apologize. Dan/Bill,
I suppose my feedback stems from oddities I get when I feel like I’m testing code in FF, IE (5+) and Opera figuring I’ve hit the majority of browsers only to have a “This doesn’t look right in Safari” comment. Normally, the differences between the browsers are pretty small when you stick to standards-based code – but it’s hard for me (and the company I work for) to justify additional work hours to support a browser that has a small user base if there are problems.

There may be problems with this particular library, but I was reacting to the “Weak. Doesn’t work in Safari” comment rather than really taking a look at the code being presented.

That being said, I apologize.

]]> By: Henrik http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66720 Henrik Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:33:56 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66720 »Bill Snebold ++ »Bill Snebold
++

]]> By: AB http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66682 AB Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:27:37 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66682 This is not valid. Not even close to being valid. This would merely be bad if it were not for the fact that there are many many ways to acheive this using valid markup. Why is this even getting attention? This is not valid. Not even close to being valid. This would merely be bad if it were not for the fact that there are many many ways to acheive this using valid markup. Why is this even getting attention?

]]> By: Dan http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66681 Dan Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:25:45 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66681 Nope Nope

]]> By: Dan http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66680 Dan Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:23:28 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66680 It's fair for a toolkit in this day and age to support Safari. Lets see if the posting bug is fixed ... It’s fair for a toolkit in this day and age to support Safari.

Lets see if the posting bug is fixed …

]]> By: Jon http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66678 Jon Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:16:51 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66678 Bill...your snide remark is a bit disconcerting. You're assuming that if a toolkit doesn't work in 0.5% of the entire world population of browsers, then it's 'weak'. Give us a break. Try being constructive; if the kit is built on prototype, then the breakdown is in their script with regards to safari and can probably be fixed. Bill…your snide remark is a bit disconcerting. You’re assuming that if a toolkit doesn’t work in 0.5% of the entire world population of browsers, then it’s ‘weak’. Give us a break.

Try being constructive; if the kit is built on prototype, then the breakdown is in their script with regards to safari and can probably be fixed.

]]> By: Bill Snebold http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66665 Bill Snebold Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:31:02 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66665 Weak. Doesn't work in Safari. Weak. Doesn’t work in Safari.

]]> By: Tahir http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66653 Tahir Mon, 14 Aug 2006 16:19:45 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66653 This is in some sense similar to <a href="http://www.mnot.net/javascript/hinclude.html" title="Hinclude" rel="nofollow">Hinclude</a>. Both of these are nice for simple useless includes but not really useable in mainstream applications. One major thing which is missing from these types of framework(s) is ability to parse javascript as part of returning content. For example if you include a page which contains document.write(); it simply gets lost. This is in some sense similar to Hinclude. Both of these are nice for simple useless includes but not really useable in mainstream applications. One major thing which is missing from these types of framework(s) is ability to parse javascript as part of returning content. For example if you include a page which contains document.write(); it simply gets lost.

]]> By: ScriptTeaser » Blog Archive » More Invalid Ajax http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer/comment-page-1#comment-66649 ScriptTeaser » Blog Archive » More Invalid Ajax Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:55:28 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/archives/introducing-laco-or-ajax-for-the-non-programmer#comment-66649 [...] From the Ajaxian weblog comes a new Ajax library, LaCo. [...] [...] From the Ajaxian weblog comes a new Ajax library, LaCo. [...]

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