<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: RIA Data Loading Benchmarks</title>
	<atom:link href="http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks</link>
	<description>Cleaning up the web with Ajax</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 09 Feb 2012 06:55:33 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Charles</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254676</link>
		<dc:creator>Charles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 17:47:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254676</guid>
		<description>&gt; Other frameworks utilize a user driven paging paradigm.
&gt;This benchmark was created specifically to show how RIAs deal with large data sets. [from blog comments]

  I would be very interested to see a simple paging vs paging test!  I think paging is the obvious solution for any dataset large enough that the size creates a performance issue, whether the paging is coded from the front- or back- end.  I imagine enough developers would be interested that paging code would be easy to find.
  On the other hand, if Flex is crazy fast with data, I&#039;d like to see how it handles situations where you &lt;em&gt;don&#039;t&lt;/em&gt;want paging, and you &lt;i&gt;want&lt;/i&gt;5000 rows. (i.e. graphing large datasets)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt; Other frameworks utilize a user driven paging paradigm.<br />
&gt;This benchmark was created specifically to show how RIAs deal with large data sets. [from blog comments]</p>
<p>  I would be very interested to see a simple paging vs paging test!  I think paging is the obvious solution for any dataset large enough that the size creates a performance issue, whether the paging is coded from the front- or back- end.  I imagine enough developers would be interested that paging code would be easy to find.<br />
  On the other hand, if Flex is crazy fast with data, I&#8217;d like to see how it handles situations where you <em>don&#8217;t</em>want paging, and you <i>want</i>5000 rows. (i.e. graphing large datasets)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Rey Bango</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254664</link>
		<dc:creator>Rey Bango</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 14:59:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254664</guid>
		<description>@Frank: No prob. Sorry for the initial confusion. I guess I clicked too quickly. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Frank: No prob. Sorry for the initial confusion. I guess I clicked too quickly. :)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Frank Thuerigen</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254663</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank Thuerigen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 14:07:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254663</guid>
		<description>Now it starts making sense... thx for the update, Rey :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now it starts making sense&#8230; thx for the update, Rey :-)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Venkat</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254661</link>
		<dc:creator>Venkat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 13:49:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254661</guid>
		<description>Amazing! Flex is very fast!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amazing! Flex is very fast!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Albert KÃ¼hner</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254641</link>
		<dc:creator>Albert KÃ¼hner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 07:42:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254641</guid>
		<description>A question about AJAX-JSON: Is there a performance difference if you dynamically create a script tag which loads a generated js file in which all objects are serialized to JavaScript objects (like JSON but without having to eval() the XHR response)?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A question about AJAX-JSON: Is there a performance difference if you dynamically create a script tag which loads a generated js file in which all objects are serialized to JavaScript objects (like JSON but without having to eval() the XHR response)?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: James Ward</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254639</link>
		<dc:creator>James Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 06:36:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254639</guid>
		<description>@Rey - The code is all open source on Sourceforge: http://sf.net/projects/flexapps and feel free to email me if you have any questions / comments: james  jamesward  org

@Michal - Paging is not something specific to Flex.  It&#039;s a technique that is widely used for large data sets.  Flex (as well as Open Rico) support transparent paging in datagrids.  Other frameworks utilize a user driven paging paradigm.  Either way you are right that paged data is a different paradigm than non-paged data and I should make this more clear in the results.  Thanks for the feedback.  This will be at the top of my list for the next version of this benchmark app.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Rey &#8211; The code is all open source on Sourceforge: <a href="http://sf.net/projects/flexapps" rel="nofollow">http://sf.net/projects/flexapps</a> and feel free to email me if you have any questions / comments: james  jamesward  org</p>
<p>@Michal &#8211; Paging is not something specific to Flex.  It&#8217;s a technique that is widely used for large data sets.  Flex (as well as Open Rico) support transparent paging in datagrids.  Other frameworks utilize a user driven paging paradigm.  Either way you are right that paged data is a different paradigm than non-paged data and I should make this more clear in the results.  Thanks for the feedback.  This will be at the top of my list for the next version of this benchmark app.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Michal Tatarynowicz</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254633</link>
		<dc:creator>Michal Tatarynowicz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 03:13:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254633</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m sorry for being so harsh on James, and I know that a _professional_ would probably know how to read the results. The problem is that _my boss_ (a professional, for sure, but in a different field) could take look at them, and ask me to redo our apps using Flex, which would be unnecessary and potentially damaging (not to mention expensive and time-consuming).

Thank you for updating the tests. I still think that paged Flex bandwidth test (which _does_ transfer less data) result should be separated from other results and marked for obviousness, or removed from the test whatsoever -- it&#039;s comparing apples and oranges. Think about it, wouldn&#039;t you raise an objection if I posted results showing that Ajax/Json used 50 times less bandwidth than Flex?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m sorry for being so harsh on James, and I know that a _professional_ would probably know how to read the results. The problem is that _my boss_ (a professional, for sure, but in a different field) could take look at them, and ask me to redo our apps using Flex, which would be unnecessary and potentially damaging (not to mention expensive and time-consuming).</p>
<p>Thank you for updating the tests. I still think that paged Flex bandwidth test (which _does_ transfer less data) result should be separated from other results and marked for obviousness, or removed from the test whatsoever &#8212; it&#8217;s comparing apples and oranges. Think about it, wouldn&#8217;t you raise an objection if I posted results showing that Ajax/Json used 50 times less bandwidth than Flex?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Rey Bango</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254630</link>
		<dc:creator>Rey Bango</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 02:14:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254630</guid>
		<description>@Rufus: I took the screenshot posted. I simply went through each test listed and ran it. That&#039;s it. In fact, I re-ran the tests and reposted the results as an update because James pointed out a possible discrepancy with the Ajax JSON results. I don&#039;t believe James is trying pull a fast one on anyone but is simply trying to show some benchmarks that he&#039;s generated. If you&#039;re concerned about the tests, you should contact James and ask for the code so that you can evaluate it and come to an opinion. I&#039;m sure that if you come to different results, James would be more than happy to compare notes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Rufus: I took the screenshot posted. I simply went through each test listed and ran it. That&#8217;s it. In fact, I re-ran the tests and reposted the results as an update because James pointed out a possible discrepancy with the Ajax JSON results. I don&#8217;t believe James is trying pull a fast one on anyone but is simply trying to show some benchmarks that he&#8217;s generated. If you&#8217;re concerned about the tests, you should contact James and ask for the code so that you can evaluate it and come to an opinion. I&#8217;m sure that if you come to different results, James would be more than happy to compare notes.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: James Ward</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254624</link>
		<dc:creator>James Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 23:56:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254624</guid>
		<description>@Rufus - The chart labels that bar as &quot;Flex Paged&quot;.  I am sure that Rey, who created the screenshot, had no intention of deceiving anyone.  Also I believe that anyone who uses the benchmark app understands that the data for that test is paged in.  Is there something more I should do to make if clear that the data for that test gets paged in?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Rufus &#8211; The chart labels that bar as &#8220;Flex Paged&#8221;.  I am sure that Rey, who created the screenshot, had no intention of deceiving anyone.  Also I believe that anyone who uses the benchmark app understands that the data for that test is paged in.  Is there something more I should do to make if clear that the data for that test gets paged in?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Rufus</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254621</link>
		<dc:creator>Rufus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 23:03:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254621</guid>
		<description>@James

There&#039;s a chart that makes it look like flex uses a tiny fraction of the bandwidth used by other techniques. But when you read more of the details you find that the flex test just doesn&#039;t load all the data.

What--other than an attempt to deceive--would cause someone to make a chart comparing flex&#039;s performance on partial data against other technologies&#039; performance on a full data set?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@James</p>
<p>There&#8217;s a chart that makes it look like flex uses a tiny fraction of the bandwidth used by other techniques. But when you read more of the details you find that the flex test just doesn&#8217;t load all the data.</p>
<p>What&#8211;other than an attempt to deceive&#8211;would cause someone to make a chart comparing flex&#8217;s performance on partial data against other technologies&#8217; performance on a full data set?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: James Ward</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254614</link>
		<dc:creator>James Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 21:21:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254614</guid>
		<description>@Charles - For many applications Ajax JSON is enough.  Many others need the power of a JIT enabled VM and a binary serialization protocol.  I created the Census benchmark to help people understand when Ajax JSON is enough and when they need something more powerful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Charles &#8211; For many applications Ajax JSON is enough.  Many others need the power of a JIT enabled VM and a binary serialization protocol.  I created the Census benchmark to help people understand when Ajax JSON is enough and when they need something more powerful.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Charles</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254611</link>
		<dc:creator>Charles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 21:00:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254611</guid>
		<description>I agree, Andrea, I don&#039;t even need a test to know that AJAX JSON is the winner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree, Andrea, I don&#8217;t even need a test to know that AJAX JSON is the winner.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: James Ward</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254608</link>
		<dc:creator>James Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 20:11:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254608</guid>
		<description>@Chad - Read the comments.  This has been addressed already.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Chad &#8211; Read the comments.  This has been addressed already.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Chad Grant</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254607</link>
		<dc:creator>Chad Grant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 20:00:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254607</guid>
		<description>The JSON results seem extremely skewed. How is it possible that a JSON has more bandwidth than XML? Also, once the JSON is parsed into a native object on the client it is much faster than querying an XML DOM over and over. 

I really think you should re-think how you&#039;re testing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The JSON results seem extremely skewed. How is it possible that a JSON has more bandwidth than XML? Also, once the JSON is parsed into a native object on the client it is much faster than querying an XML DOM over and over. </p>
<p>I really think you should re-think how you&#8217;re testing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: James Ward</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254600</link>
		<dc:creator>James Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 18:01:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254600</guid>
		<description>Rufus, can you explain why you feel that way?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rufus, can you explain why you feel that way?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Rufus</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254599</link>
		<dc:creator>Rufus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 17:55:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254599</guid>
		<description>Obviously an unfair and dishonest test.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obviously an unfair and dishonest test.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andrea Giammarchi</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254598</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrea Giammarchi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 17:23:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254598</guid>
		<description>after update we can see on new image a realistic result ... and in my opinion, we can see that Ajax JSON is the best &quot;free and open source&quot; solution too.

Well, at this point, I wasn&#039;t so wrong 8)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>after update we can see on new image a realistic result &#8230; and in my opinion, we can see that Ajax JSON is the best &#8220;free and open source&#8221; solution too.</p>
<p>Well, at this point, I wasn&#8217;t so wrong 8)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: James Ward</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254590</link>
		<dc:creator>James Ward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 15:23:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254590</guid>
		<description>@Michal - Only one Flex test uses data paging.  All the others do in fact transfer all 5000 rows.  Also I have already noted that it is possible that Rey may have loaded more rows for the JSON test.  He is looking into that.  Feel free to run the tests on your own and see what results you get.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Michal &#8211; Only one Flex test uses data paging.  All the others do in fact transfer all 5000 rows.  Also I have already noted that it is possible that Rey may have loaded more rows for the JSON test.  He is looking into that.  Feel free to run the tests on your own and see what results you get.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Michal Tatarynowicz</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254588</link>
		<dc:creator>Michal Tatarynowicz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 15:05:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254588</guid>
		<description>This benchmark should be taken with a grain of salt the size of a volleyball.

If I understand correctly, the author knowingly lowered the transfer time and bandwidth results for paged Flex 50 (fifty) fold. He writes &quot;I ran a test using 5000 rows&quot; whereas the results for paged Flex are given for a transfer of a 100 rows.

In comments above, he writes &quot;JSON is usually only slightly smaller than XML because all you really save on is the close tag.&quot;, which in itself is only a half-truth at best. What I&#039;d like to know, though, is why does the &quot;slightly smaller&quot; JSON transfer take twice the bandwidth of XML?

I&#039;m sorry, but this benchmark seems to be paid for by Adobe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This benchmark should be taken with a grain of salt the size of a volleyball.</p>
<p>If I understand correctly, the author knowingly lowered the transfer time and bandwidth results for paged Flex 50 (fifty) fold. He writes &#8220;I ran a test using 5000 rows&#8221; whereas the results for paged Flex are given for a transfer of a 100 rows.</p>
<p>In comments above, he writes &#8220;JSON is usually only slightly smaller than XML because all you really save on is the close tag.&#8221;, which in itself is only a half-truth at best. What I&#8217;d like to know, though, is why does the &#8220;slightly smaller&#8221; JSON transfer take twice the bandwidth of XML?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sorry, but this benchmark seems to be paid for by Adobe.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Rey Bango</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/ria-data-loading-benchmarks/comment-page-1#comment-254587</link>
		<dc:creator>Rey Bango</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 15:00:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=2711#comment-254587</guid>
		<description>@James: I&#039;m not sure if that was the case but I&#039;ll rerun the tests and repost a new pic just to be sure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@James: I&#8217;m not sure if that was the case but I&#8217;ll rerun the tests and repost a new pic just to be sure.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

