Comments on: The Pros and Cons of Adobe AIR http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air Cleaning up the web with Ajax Thu, 09 Feb 2012 06:55:33 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2 By: Chris Leeman http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254992 Chris Leeman Wed, 05 Sep 2007 06:37:57 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254992 Nice writing an article that's 90% someone else's content. You may as well just have stopped after posting the link. Nice writing an article that’s 90% someone else’s content. You may as well just have stopped after posting the link.

]]> By: LKM http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254928 LKM Tue, 04 Sep 2007 13:59:58 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254928 >that doesn’t mean that EVERYTHING needs to be OSS If the result of my work is locked into a proprietary format from which it can't escape, it's not an option for me. I don't want to risk the future of my company on the whims of Adobe if I can avoid it. The next time Adobe changes its strategy, I'm screwed. Thanks, but no thanks. >that doesn’t mean that EVERYTHING needs to be OSS

If the result of my work is locked into a proprietary format from which it can’t escape, it’s not an option for me. I don’t want to risk the future of my company on the whims of Adobe if I can avoid it.

The next time Adobe changes its strategy, I’m screwed. Thanks, but no thanks.

]]> By: John Nicholas http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254917 John Nicholas Tue, 04 Sep 2007 12:45:32 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254917 Midnight Coders is releasing a version of WebOrb that can be embedded in AIR apps and provides direct access to local databases. (http://www.themidnightcoders.com/blog/archives/2007_07_01_archive.html) This is really interesting because it give the same results as the ODBC style access but lets flash/flex developers work with data the same way they are used to. <blockquote>So AIR is essentially another webkit based web browser that will play swf’s and any old regular HTML locally… Please explain what I’m missing…</blockquote> AIR isn't a brand new idea completely unconnected with all that has come before it. It is a collection of technologies that a huge number of developers already know well neatly bundled together. That alone makes it useful. Especially don't underestimate the built-in SQLite as being very appealing. For most development projects, especially those that are for internal use, ease of development is more important than ultimate performance. Look at the huge numbers of Access/Filemaker apps out there. Everyone using these apps hates their usability and scaling limits but aren't going to find a C++ shop to rebuild them. If they did the interface would probably still be a mess. Now the same shop that did their web site can probably do it. Midnight Coders is releasing a version of WebOrb that can be embedded in AIR apps and provides direct access to local databases. (http://www.themidnightcoders.com/blog/archives/2007_07_01_archive.html) This is really interesting because it give the same results as the ODBC style access but lets flash/flex developers work with data the same way they are used to.

So AIR is essentially another webkit based web browser that will play swf’s and any old regular HTML locally… Please explain what I’m missing…

AIR isn’t a brand new idea completely unconnected with all that has come before it. It is a collection of technologies that a huge number of developers already know well neatly bundled together. That alone makes it useful. Especially don’t underestimate the built-in SQLite as being very appealing.

For most development projects, especially those that are for internal use, ease of development is more important than ultimate performance. Look at the huge numbers of Access/Filemaker apps out there. Everyone using these apps hates their usability and scaling limits but aren’t going to find a C++ shop to rebuild them. If they did the interface would probably still be a mess. Now the same shop that did their web site can probably do it.

]]> By: Martin http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254894 Martin Mon, 03 Sep 2007 23:22:31 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254894 Vance, but get your facts straight before you bash things. The "useless" Apple widgets can have full host access and bind Objective-C Cocoa. So you can use all the great stuff like Core Data and whatsnot. Vance, but get your facts straight before you bash things. The “useless” Apple widgets can have full host access and bind Objective-C Cocoa. So you can use all the great stuff like Core Data and whatsnot.

]]> By: Vance Dubberly http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254892 Vance Dubberly Mon, 03 Sep 2007 22:32:33 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254892 I tend to think that items 1 and 2 in the cons list are Pro's. The point of AIR would appear to be simplicity. It lives a space between the useless widgets ( Apple Dashboard and Yahoo Widgets ), and full blown apps. You are not going to use AIR to write photoshop, you are going to use it to write lightweight network oriented apps with an offline component... simply put there is no need for a database interface like JDBC or ODBC ( and providing one would present serious security concerns for the service provider ) if you need access to system packages outside what's included you should probably consider a real programming language for your real programming problem. Don't wear a Gorilla suit to a Masquerade, it's not a costume party. If you haven't guessed I adore Air. I tend to think that items 1 and 2 in the cons list are Pro’s. The point of AIR would appear to be simplicity. It lives a space between the useless widgets ( Apple Dashboard and Yahoo Widgets ), and full blown apps. You are not going to use AIR to write photoshop, you are going to use it to write lightweight network oriented apps with an offline component… simply put there is no need for a database interface like JDBC or ODBC ( and providing one would present serious security concerns for the service provider ) if you need access to system packages outside what’s included you should probably consider a real programming language for your real programming problem. Don’t wear a Gorilla suit to a Masquerade, it’s not a costume party.

If you haven’t guessed I adore Air.

]]> By: Chris Phillips http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254891 Chris Phillips Mon, 03 Sep 2007 21:54:01 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254891 So AIR is essentially another webkit based web browser that will play swf's and any old regular HTML locally... Can't Flash publish to exe without AIR? Can't any web-browser display local files and run javascript inside them? 10 years ago I wrapped an entire website up in a Macromedia Director "Projector" exe that leverage MSIE as an ActiveX to (re)host the webfiles; this also gave me FULL access to 3rd party DLL's and the Windows or Mac OS. This is nothing new or even better than what we had before. Please explain what I'm missing... So AIR is essentially another webkit based web browser that will play swf’s and any old regular HTML locally… Can’t Flash publish to exe without AIR? Can’t any web-browser display local files and run javascript inside them? 10 years ago I wrapped an entire website up in a Macromedia Director “Projector” exe that leverage MSIE as an ActiveX to (re)host the webfiles; this also gave me FULL access to 3rd party DLL’s and the Windows or Mac OS. This is nothing new or even better than what we had before. Please explain what I’m missing…

]]> By: Martin http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254886 Martin Mon, 03 Sep 2007 17:07:23 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254886 Apple has completed the switch to Intel some time ago and they have not dropped PPC support. And there is no indication they plan to do so. Apple and Macs are known for their long hardware usage. Apple has completed the switch to Intel some time ago and they have not dropped PPC support. And there is no indication they plan to do so. Apple and Macs are known for their long hardware usage.

]]> By: Richard Crowley http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254885 Richard Crowley Mon, 03 Sep 2007 16:42:07 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254885 Without the ability to build in extra libraries, AIR was essentially useless to me. Enter XULRunner, the very extensible base of Firefox and Thunderbird. It provides easy ways to build new components in either Javascript or native code, plus more things AIR is missing like multithreading, PPC support and a not-going-anywhere-anytime-soon open source community. A tip, for anyone who bites and starts using XULRunner: use the 1.9 branch. Though it's still in alpha, the changes since 1.8 are very useful. Without the ability to build in extra libraries, AIR was essentially useless to me. Enter XULRunner, the very extensible base of Firefox and Thunderbird. It provides easy ways to build new components in either Javascript or native code, plus more things AIR is missing like multithreading, PPC support and a not-going-anywhere-anytime-soon open source community.

A tip, for anyone who bites and starts using XULRunner: use the 1.9 branch. Though it’s still in alpha, the changes since 1.8 are very useful.

]]> By: Philippe http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254877 Philippe Mon, 03 Sep 2007 14:51:43 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254877 Martin said: "Adobe dropped support for PPC Macs" > ...and so is going to do Apple when they will have completely switched to Intel. Arnaud said: "Static typing allows more optimisation and AIR has probably no multithreading API." > Actionscript 3 actually does static typing (as well as dynamic), but admittedly it is missing multithreading - so yes, you won't do heavy calculations in AIR apps :) Martin said: “Adobe dropped support for PPC Macs”
> …and so is going to do Apple when they will have completely switched to Intel.

Arnaud said: “Static typing allows more optimisation and AIR has probably no multithreading API.”
> Actionscript 3 actually does static typing (as well as dynamic), but admittedly it is missing multithreading – so yes, you won’t do heavy calculations in AIR apps :)

]]> By: Bryan Rieger http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254876 Bryan Rieger Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:53:49 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254876 Being proprietary isn't necessarily always a bad thing, it's more a question of managing the liabilities in regards to all of the 'what ifs'. Q. What if Apple migrated to Intel chips rather than PPC? A. You either invest in an Intel Mac moving forward, be satisfied with your existing PPC machine or migrate to another platform. Q. What if Adobe drops AIR like it did Central, Drumbeat, SiteSpring, Freehand, Multiuser Server, Atmosphere, SVG Viewer, LiveMotion, etc. A. You hope you can migrate your AIR apps to something else, or at least continue to run your AIR apps until such time as another option presents itself. Q. What if you can use Adobe AIR to make great internet connected cross-platform desktop applications using familiar technologies? A. You embrace it and enjoy it while it lasts and meets your needs. Q. What if my favourite distro of Linux is abandoned? A. Move to another or roll up your sleeves and dive in. Change happens - we've all been burned - just be pragmatic about it. It's current a 1.0 beta release. If it appears too risky or immature at the moment perhaps it's best to wait until 1.x or even 2.0 to re-evalute? Being proprietary isn’t necessarily always a bad thing, it’s more a question of managing the liabilities in regards to all of the ‘what ifs’.

Q. What if Apple migrated to Intel chips rather than PPC?
A. You either invest in an Intel Mac moving forward, be satisfied with your existing PPC machine or migrate to another platform.

Q. What if Adobe drops AIR like it did Central, Drumbeat, SiteSpring, Freehand, Multiuser Server, Atmosphere, SVG Viewer, LiveMotion, etc.
A. You hope you can migrate your AIR apps to something else, or at least continue to run your AIR apps until such time as another option presents itself.

Q. What if you can use Adobe AIR to make great internet connected cross-platform desktop applications using familiar technologies?
A. You embrace it and enjoy it while it lasts and meets your needs.

Q. What if my favourite distro of Linux is abandoned?
A. Move to another or roll up your sleeves and dive in.

Change happens – we’ve all been burned – just be pragmatic about it.
It’s current a 1.0 beta release. If it appears too risky or immature at the moment perhaps it’s best to wait until 1.x or even 2.0 to re-evalute?

]]> By: em_te http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254873 em_te Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:52:08 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254873 I think he means proprietary as in, not standardized by an impartial organization. So the opposite isn't OSS, but standardized technologies like HTML and CSS. I think he means proprietary as in, not standardized by an impartial organization. So the opposite isn’t OSS, but standardized technologies like HTML and CSS.

]]> By: Arnaud http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254872 Arnaud Mon, 03 Sep 2007 13:47:21 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254872 "putting it on a par with Java or .NET for raw performance" Hard to believe... Static typing allows more optimisation and AIR has probably no multithreading API. “putting it on a par with Java or .NET for raw performance”
Hard to believe…
Static typing allows more optimisation and AIR has probably no multithreading API.

]]> By: Martin http://ajaxian.com/archives/the-pros-and-cons-of-adobe-air/comment-page-1#comment-254866 Martin Mon, 03 Sep 2007 12:55:17 +0000 http://ajaxian.com/?p=2735#comment-254866 Proprietary does mean it is a bad thing. Adobe dropped support for PPC Macs, so I am cold out. This is what is so dangerous about proprietary, you are at the whim of the company's policy. Ignoring this threat might be OK for some applications, but it is something not to put away lightly. I have been burned before and not only by Adobe. Proprietary does mean it is a bad thing. Adobe dropped support for PPC Macs, so I am cold out. This is what is so dangerous about proprietary, you are at the whim of the company’s policy.

Ignoring this threat might be OK for some applications, but it is something not to put away lightly. I have been burned before and not only by Adobe.

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