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	<title>Comments on: You Used JavaScript to Write WHAT?</title>
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	<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what</link>
	<description>Cleaning up the web with Ajax</description>
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		<title>By: Patrick Donelan</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260987</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick Donelan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 21:53:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260987</guid>
		<description>A few orders of magnitude better than the similar article he wrote on Perl a few days ago, but still not very insightful reading.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few orders of magnitude better than the similar article he wrote on Perl a few days ago, but still not very insightful reading.</p>
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		<title>By: mjijackson</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260983</link>
		<dc:creator>mjijackson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 19:00:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260983</guid>
		<description>Bub: You are hilarious. ;) I completely agree with you. The line has to be drawn somewhere.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bub: You are hilarious. ;) I completely agree with you. The line has to be drawn somewhere.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Bub</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260971</link>
		<dc:creator>Bub</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:12:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260971</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s absurd to say that media-intensive, or any other applications &#039;don&#039;t belong&#039; on the web. If your users are willing to install the Flash plugin, why not? Oh! the video editing doesn&#039;t work in Lynx... how dare they?!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s absurd to say that media-intensive, or any other applications &#8216;don&#8217;t belong&#8217; on the web. If your users are willing to install the Flash plugin, why not? Oh! the video editing doesn&#8217;t work in Lynx&#8230; how dare they?!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Mac</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260970</link>
		<dc:creator>Mac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:01:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260970</guid>
		<description>&quot;If this article had been written just a few short years ago, I might have used an e-mail application as the ridiculous example of when not to use JavaScript, instead of Halo. But Gmail has pushed through that barrier. &quot;

People tend to forget history. In 1999 Microsoft created the XMLHttpRequest object in Internet Explorer 5 and used it for the Outlook Web Access supplied with the Microsoft Exchange Server 2000. 
That was the first e-mail application taking advantage of Ajax.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If this article had been written just a few short years ago, I might have used an e-mail application as the ridiculous example of when not to use JavaScript, instead of Halo. But Gmail has pushed through that barrier. &#8221;</p>
<p>People tend to forget history. In 1999 Microsoft created the XMLHttpRequest object in Internet Explorer 5 and used it for the Outlook Web Access supplied with the Microsoft Exchange Server 2000.<br />
That was the first e-mail application taking advantage of Ajax.</p>
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		<title>By: K9</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260968</link>
		<dc:creator>K9</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:52:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260968</guid>
		<description>With AIR, XAML, etc. the &quot;web app&quot; side of things is coming closer to the desktop, and of course more desktop components support web-like functionality. So it seems futile to say that any given app will never be a web app. 

I wish the article went into some more fundamental limits, i.e. we know that &lt;a href=&quot;http://rescomp.stanford.edu/~cheshire/rants/Latency.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;network latency limits&lt;/a&gt; mean that loops which have to run more than a few times a second will never be possible to implement in a client-server fashion. Therefore certain highly interactive features (say dragging and dropping) have to occur in the client, whether that be javascript or C++. 

In other words maybe its not about which applications will become web apps, but about which layers and aspects of apps will occur on clients and which on servers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With AIR, XAML, etc. the &#8220;web app&#8221; side of things is coming closer to the desktop, and of course more desktop components support web-like functionality. So it seems futile to say that any given app will never be a web app. </p>
<p>I wish the article went into some more fundamental limits, i.e. we know that <a href="http://rescomp.stanford.edu/~cheshire/rants/Latency.html" rel="nofollow">network latency limits</a> mean that loops which have to run more than a few times a second will never be possible to implement in a client-server fashion. Therefore certain highly interactive features (say dragging and dropping) have to occur in the client, whether that be javascript or C++. </p>
<p>In other words maybe its not about which applications will become web apps, but about which layers and aspects of apps will occur on clients and which on servers.</p>
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		<title>By: jdbartlett</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260959</link>
		<dc:creator>jdbartlett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 14:46:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260959</guid>
		<description>Ok, I finished reading the article now, and guess what: I was right, Michael didn&#039;t finish his research.  It&#039;s complete tosh.  He summarized the whole thing in this sentence: &quot;The problem with casually injecting Ajax (JavaScript) into traditional Web applications that don&#039;t desperately need it is that you run the risk of making the application dependent on JavaScript.&quot;

Yeah, it&#039;s a crying shame no one came up with a system whereby we could casually inject Ajax into traditional web applications without negatively affecting browsers that don&#039;t support it.  We could call it &quot;degradable Ajax&quot; and could write entire books about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok, I finished reading the article now, and guess what: I was right, Michael didn&#8217;t finish his research.  It&#8217;s complete tosh.  He summarized the whole thing in this sentence: &#8220;The problem with casually injecting Ajax (JavaScript) into traditional Web applications that don&#8217;t desperately need it is that you run the risk of making the application dependent on JavaScript.&#8221;</p>
<p>Yeah, it&#8217;s a crying shame no one came up with a system whereby we could casually inject Ajax into traditional web applications without negatively affecting browsers that don&#8217;t support it.  We could call it &#8220;degradable Ajax&#8221; and could write entire books about it.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: jdbartlett</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260958</link>
		<dc:creator>jdbartlett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 14:39:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260958</guid>
		<description>&quot;Itâ€™s okay to forego users who lack JavaScript support. Google has embraced this philosophy in... Gmail&quot;

Good job I didn&#039;t know about this when I used Gmail in Lynx a couple of years ago; I wouldn&#039;t have bothered.  Oddly enough it seemed to work fine.  It&#039;s almost as though Michael didn&#039;t finish his research.  I was disappointed it didn&#039;t support Google Maps, though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Itâ€™s okay to forego users who lack JavaScript support. Google has embraced this philosophy in&#8230; Gmail&#8221;</p>
<p>Good job I didn&#8217;t know about this when I used Gmail in Lynx a couple of years ago; I wouldn&#8217;t have bothered.  Oddly enough it seemed to work fine.  It&#8217;s almost as though Michael didn&#8217;t finish his research.  I was disappointed it didn&#8217;t support Google Maps, though.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: David Carrington</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260951</link>
		<dc:creator>David Carrington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 12:47:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260951</guid>
		<description>And Google Maps works on my phone just fine with standard HTML movement arrow links.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And Google Maps works on my phone just fine with standard HTML movement arrow links.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: RichieHindle</title>
		<link>http://ajaxian.com/archives/you-used-javascript-to-write-what/comment-page-1#comment-260949</link>
		<dc:creator>RichieHindle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 12:40:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ajaxian.com/?p=3260#comment-260949</guid>
		<description>Funny... my Gmail has a &quot;basic HTML&quot; link at the bottom.  I wonder which Gmail he&#039;s using?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Funny&#8230; my Gmail has a &#8220;basic HTML&#8221; link at the bottom.  I wonder which Gmail he&#8217;s using?</p>
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